william black

I was in Southall a couple of days ago and was interested to see that the
food was nearly all Punjabi with only a couple of 'South Indian' type places
selling Dosas.

Got a decent cup of masala tea though, for the first time outside India...

--
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

gareth

Stop it. Teasing people like that :-)

Seriously, I've found it to be very hit and miss in terms of the response to
genuine interest. Some owners greet me by name and, I suspect, would be only
too willing to allow me to sample authentic food (if I was brave enough to
ask). But I had shocking service the other night during the opening night of
a new restaurant - we had a table for two and the service was appalling: the
waiters unashamedly prioritised tables of 4 or more and even offered
complimentary drinks to tables of 4 or more. They've lost what would have
been a bloody good customer in the form of myself - and they don't even realise it.

No, I haven't but I may give it a go. But I'm really looking for authentic
Indian Indian food - Sikh and Hindu. Quite a few of the places in Southall
I've tried (despite being Sikh or Hindu owned) still provide the same
British Indian restaurant takeaway fare. I'm not criticising the standard
fare - it's amazing food and by far my favourite food full stop (anyone who
hasn't tried it is missing out big time) - but I would like to try authentic
Indian food (south of the Indian Pakistani border).

Yes. I do have qualms about halal meat as well. Kosher meat is, it is
claimed, prepared with more attention given to animal welfare (a fundamental
requirement for complicated reasons of Kosher). But no, I wouldn't eat
Kosher either - nor would I want to try anything other than lamb, chicken or
beef (I have qualms about eating pork).

You know I've been wanting to ask for such a thing for years but haven't had
the courage. A filling on the bone chicken dish. Actually, now I think of
it, I did once ask a very good takeaway manager of an incredible quality
open kitchen takeaway (takeaway now closed) whether he could prepare a Quorn
dish for a vegetarian friend: he told me to bring him the Quorn and watch
him cook it. I never did but I wish I had.


Oh right - just found her website. Looks interesting. The sauce recipe is
very interesting. I had previously heard of the deep fried onion method (as
opposed to boiled onion method) for producing authentic sauce. I may give
this one a go.


It's good to know, seriously, that the tradition where you are is self
confident enough to provide authentic food as part of the mainstream menu.
Here it is not :-(

Well, this is a point of view - but I don't agree with it. The EU labour
migration is virtually all one way traffic (blame the UK education system
and cultural norms which still don't take second language acquisition
seriously). But more importantly why should migrant workers from India and
Pakistan (staying in the UK for a short period of time) be disadvantaged by
a racist policy which doesn't even acknowledge the obligation that the UK
arguably has to certain countries for decades of exploitation?

True. But it is far from clear that new generations want to mould their
lives around the restaurant - law, medicine, accountancy, mechanics and
estate agency are much more attractive.


No. Another example of racist but apparently acceptable policy. The UK is
changing and old assumptions about cultural mix and dominant culture are
fast changing. But no UK government - including the Scottish Executive -
wants to open the doors to Romany Gypsy travellers.

gareth

Were these fast food joints as opposed to well rounded
restaurants/takeaways? There are some very good vegetarian restaurants in
Southall but the majority of non vegetarian restaurants sell mainstream British Indian food.

It should hardly be brain surgey but, yes, it is odd isn't it that such
simple things are not more readily available in their authentic form. Same
with lassi.

Gareth.

william black

The fast food places that pretty obviously serve the local working population.

Well 'tea masala' isn't something I've ever seen on sale in the UK, we
bring ours back from India.

As for lassi, my wife, who is Indian, makes it and I've never bought it
'over the counter' in the UK.

--
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

gareth

Thought so. They're okay for a quick bite but there isn't surprisingly much
choice in terms of authentic restaurant or higher quality takeaway food.


I've seen it - can't think where though (wasn't looking for it but I have
seen it in the past month or so in, I'm sure, a number of general stores).
This is really bugging - I have seen it but can't remember where. It was in
a cigarette size packet (can't remember if it was plain white or green).

Oh well, you're no doubt spoilt then when it comes to authentic Indian food!
A number of items are difficult to come by in the UK though - I've never
found a source of black cardamom for example. The lassi can be okay but it
isn't up to the standard of an authentic Indian or Sri Lankan lassi. Can't
work out why with such basic ingredients.

Gareth.

william black

Oh yes :-)

We've seen it in a warehouse belonging to a friend who sells the stuff in
wholesale quantities in Bradford, but never in the shops here.

There are fundamental problems with the quality of spices imported to the EC
which relate to the spice cartel in India, the way the Indian government
licenses the export of spices and the EC's insanely strict regulations on
the import of spices from the East.

While there is undoubtedly a market for high quality spices from India in
the UK there seems to be no legal way of supplying that market that wouldn't
require some sort of massive investment.

We find we have about 15 Kg of spices and dried chillies in our luggage
every time we come back to the UK from India.

But things are undoubtedly getting better.

You can now get Indian 'kingfish' and even packs of Kashmiri chillies in the
UK now, although it's still cheaper to buy there and send them by courier.
(not the fish, the chillies)

The instant ' shake and bake' food they sell now is better as well,
although we did try one of the instant 'behl puri' kits and it was
dreadful...

--
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

rex m f smith

In message <48233e5c$0$2494$da0feed9@news.zen.co.uk>, Gareth
<hotmail.com@dgareth_nospam.com> writes

http://www.twenga.co.uk/dir-Gastrono...ments,Cardamom

Looking more expensive than I paid for mine; clearly I bought a fragile
packet (because I've decanted it into a recycled "Rajah" tin and
forgotten where I bought it :-( )

This is more like my price level!

http://www.spicesofindia.co.uk/acata...i-Elaichi.html

I've *seen* this packaging; so might be available somewhere near Chrisp
Street, E14
--
Rex M F Smith

mike roebuck

If we're talking about the large brown cardamom pods which are
commonly known as black cardamom, my local sub post office sells them,
as do a myriad other Asian grocers in this region.

Expensive they are not.

--
Regards

Mike

mikedotroebuckatgmxdotnet

mike roebuck

<g>

Under those circumstances, they would have lost my custom, too.


I can see your problem. I tried Southall for the same reason, but most
of the Punjabi food there is East African influenced. There are still
some interesting specialities though - curried cassava chips for one,
and the Brilliant also does Jeera Chicken and Butter Chicken, both of
which I am assured are absolutely authentic. Certainly I've never
eaten Jeera chicken like that anywhere else.

However, I think the real problem is that the Hindu population mostly
cooks at home. It really only seems to be the Muslims, and to a lesser
extent the Sikhs and Nepalese, who have the drive to run businesses like restaurants.

That's fair enough - each to his own. snip


By all means buy the books, but note that I'm not convinced all the
recipes are correct - some of them call for so much water that the
curry turns out like a thin watery soup. Use your own judgement here,
as I do. It's the techniques and some of the Indian adaptations of
British dishes I like. The idea of stuffing spiced [1] scrambled egg
into a leftover chapatti for breakfast hit the mark, too!

Yes. The rule around here seems to be that if you ask for your food
"Asian-style", you will usually get the restaurant's standard curry,
with the additon of some chopped fresh green chilli. In my particular
local, they will ask us if we want the food "proper Asian-style". This
always results in the sort of dry authentic curry I have already
described in this thread. It's only when they come and tell us what
the dish of the day is when we walk in that I suspect we are being
offered the staff curry.

Three of us ate in there the other evening - all the dishes we ordered
were on the menu; they all appeared, after the magic question had been
asked of us, in the authentic dry style - and they were very nice indeed.

Going a bit off topic here, but there are a lot of expatriate British
around the world, who speak other languages. I learned three foreign
languages at school here in England, and as a result lived on the
Continent for 25 years. If the work situation had been different, I'd still be there.

"Racist policy" seems a bit strong. It's an economic thing surely?


They may be more attractive, but many of the local Pakistani
population here run other businesses - restaurants and takeaways
abound, there are an inordinate number of wooden furniture
manufactureres and salesrooms, and all the taxi companies are Asian-run, without exception.


I agree to some extent, but I don't think it's about Romanies. It's
about not letting lots of perceived criminals into the country, and
Rumania (along with Kosovo) has a bad international reputation in this
respect. I confess I don't fully understand why the Bulgarians have
been disadvantaged, but we're getting well off-topic here.


[1] Garam Masala, HP sauce and chopped coriander leaf!
--
Regards

Mike

mikedotroebuckatgmxdotnet

william black

The decision of the courts last year concerning the treatment of doctors
with work permits, rather than being UK residents, decided that the policy
was racist because the people concerned were mainly of South Asian origin.

This being the case the decision of the British government to exclude the
kitchen porters from Bengal is certainly racist.

But it'll be a year or two before someone drags them into court over the
new 'points based' work permit system...


--
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.