wynand

I'm going to post this message in English, since I'm actually South
African, and because I doubt that my Afrikaans will get me very far
here. Feel free however to reply in Dutch, since it's easy enough for
me to understand. Ik kan net niet regtig Nederlands spreken .

I consider myself to be very left leaning, and I'm really glad that
the apartheid system was dismantled. Even though I'm an Afrikaner, I
used to hate the authoritarianism associated with Afrikaner rule.

Now, there has been another issue that I've been mulling over in my
head for a long, long time, and I still don't know what to think.

It has to do with Europe's burgeoning Islamic population. If the
immigrants had naturalised, then there would have been no issue at
all. Maybe there would have been some mosques where there formerly
were none, but otherwise things would have been quite Dutch. And that
would have been great, since it would have added an interesting side
to Dutch life.

So, the issue is with the flopped integration. Consider the following
piece that I found on this group:

"Looking over all the disrespectful things about Starr, the GOP,
Americans, etc., I have only to say: Dutch awta min nali siur mi.

Well, according to all demograpic projections, Nederlands will be
majority Moslem in early next century. It is safe to assume that Islam
will bring the moral decay of Holland and Hollanders to a halt.
It is safe to say there will be a moral jihad against what we see
today
in the Hollands.
The disrespectful and permissive things I see NLers typing , well....
off with the hands, Sha eesh mo... internet hassa.
hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahohohohohohohohohohohoho hohohohohohoho

Goede nacht Nederlands."

This really bothers me. Why? Well, I identify very closely with
Western European culture, and most strongly with the Dutch, Belgian,
German and French cultures. All of these countries are facing the same
problems with regards to integration.

So still, why would I be bothered? Well, the militancy, along with the
demands that I have read about from the Islamic groups (such as that
Arabic should become Belgium's fourth national language, that Dope
should be made illegal in the Netherlands etc etc), along with symbols
of oppresion such as the hijab and sharia law really stand to threaten
the hardwon European ideals of individual freedom.

This still would not have been a problem had the Islamic groups
remained minorities, but their relative growth far outpaces that of
the indigenous groups.

Now, much has been said about people's reproductive rights. However,
what about the rights of an indigenous group to ensure that its
culture survives? Surely that must have some merrit? How can this hot
potato be approached?

I'm sure there must moderate Muslims who play along with the unspoken
rules of immigration (i.e. of naturalisation). When I was at school I
worked at a cyber cafe that was owned by a Muslim couple that was far
more progressive than most people in South Africa.

So what is going wrong? In principle, I consider all forms of religion
to be evil, but I don't want to identify followers of a religion
*with* the religion. Even though Christianity has some possibly
horrendous interpretations, it does not follow that most Christians
are evil. On the contrary, most interpretations of Christianity are
very mild. Anyway, so whatever I think of Islam, and its various
interpretations, it most certainly does not follow that a Muslim is by
definition evil.

It's really hard to talk about these issues because of the kneejerk
reaction that most "liberals" have - you almost always instantly get
labelled as a right wing racist dog. However, these are legitimate
problems that require consideration.

I don't want Europe's wonderful liberal way of doing things to fade
away! The Netherlands' "moral decay" is WONDERFUL! Any state that
considers gay marriage on par with heterosexual marriage is WONDERFUL.
Also, the fact that euthenasia is legal is such a positive step in the
right direction. No, the "moral decay" is in fact progressive
thinking.

I can't help it, but I really feel a strong attachment with Western
European culture, and along with Scandinavian and Australian social
culture, I think this is the way forward for the rest of the world.

I'm frightened to death at the prospect of ever having to live under
sharia law.
So I guess that I want to say that I would like to see a middle road.
The Europeans respect other people's religion, and I think that the
immigrant Muslim community should do the same. Of course Muslims
should have the right to exercise their freedom, but this should never
come at the expense of the indigenous majority, and this should happen
within the parameters of naturalisation.

I don't know what to think, but I'm depressed by what I see.
Multiculturalism provides a lot of difficult issues. I wish I had
answers. I'm curious to know what others think.

--Wynand Winterbach