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1 20th June 19:26
john the man
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Posts: 1
Default Fasting on Yom Kippur (cancer chemotherapy anorexia)


Once upon a time, our fellow Tim Tyler
rambled on about "Re: Fasting on Yom Kippur."
Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...


Humans are not rats! Just thought that you might want to know.

"Malnourished and starving people are not good candidates for
spontaneous healing. ... More common reasons for insufficient
metabolic energy are inadequate diets, impaired digestions, and
improper breathinga, all of which are within your control."
-- Andrew Weil, MD in _Spontaneous Healing_

I agree with Dr. Weil on this issue. CR activities depress the immune
system of the human body. Skinny people are in a very bad position
when it comes to surviving chemotherapy or any major illness.

Educate yourself on the facts, Tyler. Search in medline under wasting
disease, muscle wasting, loss of lean body mass or sarcopenia,
anorexia, and cancer cachexia.

The pictures of people practicing CR are nothing but pictures of
walking skeletons!!!
--
John Gohde,
Achieving good Nutrition is an Art, NOT a Science!

Get started on improving your personal health and fitness, today.
http://www.Tutorials.NaturalHealthPerspective.com/
Offering easy to understand lessons that will change your life.
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2 20th June 19:26
richard schulman
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Posts: 1
Default Fasting on Yom Kippur (cancer fat)


First of all, Mr. Gohde. You're overdue for a lesson in personal
courtesy and respect. You're also overdue for a lesson in Usenet
courtesy. Five crossposts are excessive, especially given your high
ratio of invective and vain boasting to actual scientific content.


Your own behavior refutes your argument and fosters a bull market for
the studies of ethologists.


CR practitioners are not malnourished.

The medical evidence strongly indicates that skinny people are much
less likely than fat people to contract cancer in the first place.


More rudeness and projection of your own deficits, Mr. Gohde.

[Followup set to alt.duck.quack.quack.quack.]
---
Richard Schulman
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3 20th June 19:26
john the man
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Posts: 1
Default Fasting on Yom Kippur (cancer chemotherapy anorexia)


Once upon a time, our fellow Richard Schulman
rambled on about "Re: Fasting on Yom Kippur."
Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...

Yeah, ... Sure, Right! They are just walking skeletons!!

You have to die of something, Schulman, so that means cancer. Just
thought that you might want to know.

Humans are not rats! Just thought that you might want to know.

"Malnourished and starving people are not good candidates for
spontaneous healing. ... More common reasons for insufficient
metabolic energy are inadequate diets, impaired digestions, and
improper breathinga, all of which are within your control."
-- Andrew Weil, MD in _Spontaneous Healing_

I agree with Dr. Weil on this issue. CR activities depress the immune
system of the human body. Skinny people are in a very bad position
when it comes to surviving chemotherapy or any major illness.

Educate yourself on the facts, Schulman. Search in medline under
wasting disease, muscle wasting, loss of lean body mass or sarcopenia,
anorexia, and cancer cachexia.

The pictures of people practicing CR are nothing but pictures of
walking skeletons!!!

Hark! My private health newsgroup beckons!
--
John Gohde,
Achieving good Nutrition is an Art, NOT a Science!

The nutrition of eating a healthy diet is the foundation of the
biomedical model of natural health. Weighing in at 17 webpages,
Nutrition (http://www.Food.NaturalHealthPerspective.com/) is now
with more do***entation and sharper terminology than ever before.
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4 20th June 19:26
john the man
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Posts: 1
Default Fasting on Yom Kippur (cancer anorexia fat weight)


Once upon a time, our fellow Richard Schulman
rambled on about "Re: Fasting on Yom Kippur."
Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...

The biggest bunch of crock being pushed with absolutely no evidence is
that skinny is healthy.

Walking skeletons are *not* healthy. Just thought that you might want
to know.

The ideal body weight is at the high end of your normal body weight
and even slightly overweight is good, too. Searching in medline under
wasting disease, muscle wasting, loss of lean body mass or sarcopenia,
anorexia, and cancer cachexia provides the proof.

Of course, it is best, if you are muscular rather than fat.
--
John Gohde,
Achieving good Nutrition is an Art, NOT a Science!

Get started on improving your personal health and fitness, today.
http://www.Tutorials.NaturalHealthPerspective.com/
Offering easy to understand lessons that will change your life.
  Reply With Quote
5 20th June 19:26
richard schulman
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Posts: 1
Default Fasting on Yom Kippur (diet anorexia)


Your idea of skinny seems to be someone in the advanced sector with
anorexia, or a starving peasant in a famine-stricken sub-Saharan
country. Of course, these individuals aren't healthy! They're
malnourished. It's easier to be malnourished when one is thin than
otherwise, simply because food intake is lower. But skinny is healthy
when one has a balanced diet emphasizing energy-dense foods.

You're claiming that body mass index (BMI) over 25 ("slightly
overweight") is good. The evidence doesn't support this claim. For
males above a BMI of 24, mortality rises, according to the appended
Norwegian study. (There's another issue raised in this study that
needs to be discussed, but I'll save it for a subsequent post)"

Epidemiology. 2003 May;14(3):293-9.

Height and body mass index in relation to total mortality.

Engeland A, Bjorge T, Selmer RM, Tverdal A.

Division of Epidemiology, Norwegian Institute of Public Health,
Nydalen, Oslo, Norway. anders.engeland@fhi.no

BACKGROUND: The relation between body mass index (BMI) and
mortality is not clear in the literature. An inverse relation between
height and mortality has been suggested. We explore these relations in
a very large cohort in Norway. METHODS: We studied two million men and
women, age 20-74 years, who were measured during 1963-2000. These
persons were followed for an average of 22.1 years. We used Cox
proportional hazard models in the ****yses. Also, the optimal BMI (the
BMI at the time of measurement that was subsequently related to the
lowest mortality) was estimated. RESULTS: Over the study period,
723,000 deaths were registered. The relative risk of death by BMI
showed a J- or U-shaped curve, with the lowest rates of death at BMI
between 22.5 and 25.0. In men, the optimal BMI increased from 21.6
when measured at age 20-29 to 24.0 when measured at age 70-74. In
women, the optimal BMI was consistently higher, increasing from 22.2
to 25.7. Mortality decreased with increased height in men; in women,
mortality decreased with height only up to heights of about 160-164 cm
and then increased among the tallest women. CONCLUSIONS: The relation
between BMI and mortality was J- or U-shaped, with the "optimal" BMI
varying by age and ***. Height was inversely related to mortality in
men and in women up to a height of 165 cm.

PMID: 12859029 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
---
Richard Schulman
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6 20th June 19:27
rjk3
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Posts: 1
Default Fasting on Yom Kippur


Depends on whether you can tell the diference between mean life span
and maximum life span.
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7 20th June 19:27
john the man
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Posts: 1
Default Fasting on Yom Kippur


Once upon a time, our fellow RK
rambled on about "Re: Fasting on Yom Kippur."
Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nursing retorts, thusly ...


Did you hear the one about RK?

He thinks that he is going to live past the age of 120!

Ha, ... Hah, Ha!

He thinks that we should take his nutty CR claims seriously, because
they all are going to live past the age of 120. Frankly, I think
that qualifies him for the funny farm.

Ha, ... Hah, Ha! Maybe somebody should let RK in on the joke?

"... you have my sympathies"
Science Officer Ash to Ripley, in the movie ALIEN.
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8 20th June 19:27
john the man
External User
 
Posts: 1
Default Fasting on Yom Kippur (fat)


Once upon a time, our fellow Richard Schulman
rambled on about "Re: Fasting on Yom Kippur."
Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...


You are assuming that everyone is fat, but I certainly am not.

Skinny people don't have any muscle mass. And, no research study has
ever looked at *only* people with excellent muscle mass. And, no
research on rats has ever gotten them to lift weights and engage in
body building.

Just thought that you might want to know.
--
John Gohde,
Achieving good Nutrition is an Art, NOT a Science!

Get started on improving your personal health and fitness, today.
http://www.Tutorials.NaturalHealthPerspective.com/
Offering easy to understand lessons that will change your life.
  Reply With Quote
9 23rd June 06:48
rjk3
External User
 
Posts: 1
Default Fasting on Yom Kippur


You don't know what you're talking about. In fact, you're barking-mad.
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10 23rd June 06:49
richard schulman
External User
 
Posts: 1
Default Fasting on Yom Kippur (weight)


First of all, someone who starts off all his posts with an automated
adolescent formula like the above is clearly not interested in
reasonable discussion or being taken for anything other than a clown. R.S.:


I made no such assumption. You don't seem to read, much less
assimilate, what other people are saying in attempting to communicate
with you. What you did say, however, is that "The ideal body weight is
at the high end of your normal body weight and even slightly
overweight is good, too."


You need to go to more ballets and watch more marathons. Suggestion:
the NY Marathon is coming up. Have a look at all these "walking
skeletons" (in your terminology) photographed at a recent marathon: http://www.nycmarathon.org/news/index.html

Well, what are you waiting for? Maybe Governor-elect Schwarzenegger
will give you a research grant. But scientific research is one thing,
and immature claims without evidence is another. I'm especially
disgusted by your failure to have read and responded to the refereed
Norwegian study I provided in my last post. When evidence is presented
that casts doubt on one's claim that "slightly overweight is good," a
serious person -- a grownup -- will either accept the refuting
evidence or present a reasonable critique of it. You did neither. You
just ignored the evidence, created a straw man, and continued your clowning.


And yet more immature clowning. Grow up, John, misnamed 'the Man.'
---
Richard Schulman
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