Who (what govt agency or club/society) is it, that determines exactly
what the standard medical care & procedures will be, for all cancer (&
other) patients?

Susan, Su_Texas my opinions

kaye301

what the standard medical care & procedures will be, for all cancer (&
other) patients?>>

Su, in the United States I believe it is the NCI (National Cancer Institute).

Hi Kaye,

I spoke to the NCI this afternoon. They said they have a PDQ which
lists some treatment options, & that these are basically suggestions for
the doctors to use, in tailoring patient treatments.

She said that the PDQ is a comprehensive cancer database, that the
treatment summaries are peer-reviewed by doctors, ... that they have a
PDQ Editorial Board, & that there is something called a "standard of
care". ???

She recommended the Complimentary & Alternative Medicine (NCCAM,
888-644-6226) as a place where I could better find, where the doctors
who will consider & try other options (than just the standard
treatments), might be found.

Susan, Su_Texas my opinions

kaye301

888-644-6226) as a place where I could better find, where the doctors
who will consider & try other options (than just the standard
treatments), might be found.>>

Best of luck! Would be interested in what you find. I am doing some
complimentary, although wouldn't say alternative, treatments now and so far
think they have worked or will be working soon. Take care,

sandy l

Susan: I'm not sure what impression you go from your contact at NCI,
but there really isn't a mandatory standard care. NCI provides
information about the latest evidence from various trials and I believe
they provide recommendations from panels of experts, but physicians are
not obliged by law to follow those recommendations.

Susan: I'm not sure what impression you go from your contact at NCI,
but there really isn't a mandatory standard care. NCI provides
information about the latest evidence from various trials and I believe
they provide recommendations from panels of experts, but physicians are
not obliged by law to follow those recommendations.

=============

Hi Sandy,

Many doctors here are doing the minimum, & then refusing to do more.
These docs lie, con, cheat, & steal, & then openly gloat about it, as
they watch their patients suffering to death. ???

The docs say that it's about the "standard care", & if that they do this
minimum (& only that!), then they can't be sued. Then, the docs will
detach (go into their fantasy-fogs), smirk, & act like jerks.

Some docs refer to this medical noncare, as "saving the system for
themselves", as "not costing the insurance companies & govt much money",
& as "punishing those fakers" who seek medical care & are trying to "rip
off the system". ??? [Gibberish!]

The docs are NOT giving good medical care or information.

I'm trying to learn exactly what it is, that doctors keep referring to &
using, as their reason for NOT giving good care: This "standard care".
This "accepted level of care" & nothing more. ???

So far, the docs won't answer my questions about this, so I'm looking
elsewhere for answers.

It might be the corporate & govt, rules & regulations (such as Medicare
& Medicaid), which are setting & enforcing the minimum "standards" &
protocols for medical care. [[However, these rules are usually for
cutting costs (& for maximizing corporate profits) only, & are
definitely NOT in the patients' best interest.]]

I need to know why the doctors & medical care here in Texas & Louisiana,
are so danged awfully, terribly, & destructively bad, harmful, &
expensive. And why the docs aren't being punished or prosecuted, no
matter what they do.

Suffering to death, while being run in endless dumb, meaningless, &
expensive circles by the determinedly-dumb, openly uncaring &
snickering, brain-dead-type docs, is a very unpleasant & pain-filled
process.

If there is any good or quality medical care left, then I do intend to
find it, & to tell others about it.

I also want to help change the laws, so that the bad docs can be sued
for wrong-doing (such as assaults & murder), AND for their refusing to
give patients good information or care.

I want to help change the rules & regulations, so that patients will
have some rights & recourse, against the corporations, govt, &
powerful/special-interest groups.

I believe that knowledge is the first step in this process. First, know
thy enemy, know thy murderer. Then fight back with savvy.

Susan, Su_Texas my opinions

PS As you can tell, I'm in a lot of physical pain now, & am still
getting screwed by the docs.

The name of their game is: Delay, act dumb, delay, act dumb, delay, ...
while also charging $$$ for their "time" & "expert opinions". ?!

kaye301

These docs lie, con, cheat, & steal, & then openly gloat about it, as
they watch their patients suffering to death. ???>>

It's a double edged sword. If more is done that has not yet been approved and
the patient develops complications they could be held liable.
How have dr's lied? conned? cheated? and stolen?
I have found some dr's to be rigid in their beliefs at times but never who
purposefully was dishonest or ever did the things you ascribe to them.

From: kaye301@aol.com (Kaye301)

more.
These docs lie, con, cheat, & steal, & then openly gloat about it, as
they watch their patients suffering to death. ???>>

Kaye wrote:

It's a double edged sword. If more is done that has not yet been
approved and the patient develops complications they could be held
liable.
How have dr's lied? conned? cheated? and stolen? I have found some dr's
to be rigid in their beliefs at times but never who purposefully was
dishonest or ever did the things you ascribe to them.

=================

Susan writes:

Why won't the doctors do better blood-work & testing? That's basic,
doesn't involve treatments or risk, & could give patients & doctors a
much better view & insight into cancer & its treatment, ... but most
docs refuse to do it.

Why is there only chemotherapy, radiation, & then repeated CAT scans
until a fourth inch lump appears on film, ... & no other treatments?
Does this sound logical, practical, or right?

Why are we declared "cured of cancer", if we survive chemo & rads, ...
even though no test is available to prove the cancer is gone? And then,
we're medically abandoned by oncs. Does this make sense?!

Who has dictated that this is the only & best treatment for breast
cancer? Probably the govt (using Medicare & Medicaid as weapons). And
what's the govt's motive in doing this, their agenda? Usually it's cost
cutting and/or overly-profitting special interest groups, that is, the
rich & powerful few.

------------

For my cancer care, the docs told me that if I trusted them, &
cooperated with the chemo & rads, ... that next they would do what I
wanted, the good blood-testing, other therapies, etc.

After the chemo & rads, the docs dropped me & walked away
smirking/snickering. It was another rip-off. This betrayal felt
terrible.

For cancer, I'd wanted to hire a doctor who would be honest, who was
intelligent, & who would work with me so I could get the best care for
cancer. Instead, I got the minimum standard treatments (for which my
insurance paid 100%), & then dropped. ???

This medical non-care system s*cks!

-------------

As for personal experiences, each of ours will be different. I'm having
to seek medical care alone in Texas & Louisiana, which does make a huge
difference. [The govt & legal systems have failed here, so there's no
quality control over docs, & no enforceable penalties for the docs'
wrong-doing.]

However, I do realize now, that some people cannot understand what they
have not personally experienced yet.

You have a husband (a dentist?) who is going to appts with you, who is
working with, helping, & protecting you. There is probably no way that
most docs would choose to misbehave & act ugly to you, in front of him.

----------

I'm working hard to try to understand exactly why the medical system has
now failed so badly here, so that I can help change it for the better.

I'm also working very hard to survive for long enough, to find & reach
good medical care for cancer & injuries.

--------------

Most people fear learning about, facing, & dealing with reality, &
they'll avoid it at all costs.
I've always had to face & deal with it, in order to survive.

Susan, Su_Texas my opinions

PS Today, someone mentioned HICFA(sp?), a govt agency(?), as being
partly responsible for the rules which have caused the medical system to
fail in TX & La, & in other parts of the US.

So far, I've not had time to read about it.

allan_grossman

The American Society of Clinical Oncology publishes a set of
guidelines for treatment of breast cancer.

There is indeed a "standard of care" - although not legally
enforceable, receiving less than - or other than - standard of care
might place an oncologist, his clinic and the hospital they're
affiliated with at risk for a rather healthy lawsuit.

As an example if a woman presented with a 3cm tumor, was ER- and node
positive, offering the woman carrot juice, green tea and a coffee
enema instead of surgical excision and chemotherapy might be
actionable. What the patient decides is ultimately the determining
factor but the doctor is responsible for outlining accepted treatment
options.

Linda, you can check this stuff out at http://www.asco.org

catharine honeyman

What kind of bloodwork do you want done?

For example, in Seattle, until we nailed down where my mets were,
everything revolved around the alkaline phosphatase test. Is it up or
down? Here in Honolulu, my doc and I are well aware that I have bone mets,
and I'm not actively receiving any chemo, so there's no point in testing my
AP levels.

--
Aloha,
Catharine

titubant sed non decidunt wiblia