jaym1212

How is lactic acid in fermented products (ie yogurt, kefir,
sauerkraut) metabolized? Is latic acid considered a carbohydrate or
fat? What is it's glycemic index? Does lactic acid get absorbed in the
small intestines, routed to the liver, and converted to glucose? Does
the ingestion of lactic acid produce a significant rise of lactic acid
in the blood (beyond the liver)? Thx

moosh!

On 24 Oct 2003 22:03:43 -0700, jaym1212@hotmail.com (jaym1212) posted:

Ask Nick, he reckons it screw up mitochondria. Snaaaaarf!

nick

Here's a study to support my point (below). However, small amounts should
be fine, as in yogurt, though I wounld not eat the pasteurized/homogenized
stuff. Make your own grain yogurt by getting high quality whey powder, like
Metagenics, and mixing it with boiled grain (after it cools) and a bit of
Celtic Sea salt. Then let it sit in a sealed container (don't fill all the
way to the top) for a few days at 72-77 degrees F. Refrigerate for a day,
then you can eat it. It should have a sour taste, even a bit acidic. I
suggest rice, kasha, or oats.

Med Hypotheses. 1998 Jun;50(6):497-500.
Autism: a mitochondrial disorder?

Lombard J.

Westchester Square Medical Center, New York, NY 10461, USA.

Autism is a developmental disorder characterized by disturbance in language,
perception and socialization. A variety of biochemical, anatomical and
neuroradiographical studies imply a disturbance of brain energy metabolism
in autistic patients. The underlying etiology of a disturbed bioenergetic
metabolism in autism is unknown. A likely etiological possibility may
involve mitochondrial dysfunction with concomitant defects in neuronal
oxidative phosphorylation within the central nervous system. This hypothesis
is supported by a frequent association of lactic acidosis and carnitine
deficiency in autistic patients. Mitochondria are vulnerable to a wide array
of endogenous and exogenous factors which appear to be linked by excessive
nitric oxide production. Strategies to augment mitochondrial function,
either by decreasing production of endogenous toxic metabolites, reducing
nitric oxide production, or stimulating mitochondrial enzyme activity may be
beneficial in the treatment of autism.

Publication Types:
Review
Review, Tutorial

PMID: 9710323 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


Moosh! posted:

"On 24 Oct 2003 22:03:43 -0700, jaym1212@hotmail.com (jaym1212) posted:

Ask Nick, he reckons it screw up mitochondria. Snaaaaarf!"

jaym1212

The 1998 report that you cite says there is "frequent association of
lactic acidosis and carnitine deficiency in autistic patients",
however it does not establish a clear cause and effect. If lactic acid
is the cause, then shouldn't we see more autism in athletes (ie body
builders) that create more lactic acid due to strenuous activity.

The following 1999 report shows a clearer cause and effect between
casein and austism:

Casein Peptide (Milk) Appears To Cause Autism-like Behav. Disorders In
Rats
Tuesday, March 30, 1999

Scientists from the University of Florida in Gainesville believe that
they
may have found a link between autism, schizophrenia and
beta-casomorphin-7
(beta-CM7), a small peptide derived from the breakdown of casein in
milk and
milk products.

Dr. J. Robert Cade and colleagues report their findings in two papers
in the
March issue of the journal Autism.

In the first paper, the team reports that peripheral administration to
rats
of human beta-CM7 induced moderate to strong Fos-like immunoreactivity
in
regions of the brain previously implicated in autism and
schizophrenia.
These included the nucleus accumbens, caudate putamen and the
prefrontal,
temporal and occipital cortex. Pretreatment with naloxone
significantly
lessened or blocked the effects of beta-CM7.

The finding, the scientists say, suggests that beta-CM7 "...can cross
the
blood-brain barrier, activate opioid receptors and affect brain
regions
similar to those affected in schizophrenia and autism."

Dr. Cade and others also observed uptake of beta-CM7 by dopaminergic,
serotonergic and brain gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA) systems in the
rat
brain.

Dr. Cade's group says that the findings lend support to the hypothesis
that
casein intake may be involved in development of schizophrenia and
autism.
Dr. Cade and others have previously observed that patients with
schizophrenia and autism improve significantly when casein is removed
from
their diets.

In the second paper, Dr. Cade, with one of the investigators from the
previous study, reports that intravenous administration of beta-CM7
produced
analgesic effects as well as "remarkable" behavioral changes in rats.

These behavioral changes ranged from restlessness "...with teeth
chattering
and with rapid respiration..." about a minute after administration to
inactivity and avoidance of other animals 7 minutes postinjection. The
rats
were also oblivious to a bell ringing in near proximity following
beta-CM7
administration.

The findings in this particular experiment support the hypothesis that
some
of the symptoms of autism and schizophrenia are caused by
"...exorphins
produced in the intestine by the digestion of casein and gluten," Dr.
Cade
and his colleague conclude.

jaym1212

The 1998 report that you cite says there is "frequent association of
lactic acidosis and carnitine deficiency in autistic patients",
however it does not establish a clear cause and effect. If lactic acid
is the cause, then shouldn't we see more autism in athletes (ie body
builders) that create more lactic acid due to strenuous activity.

The following 1999 report shows a clearer cause and effect between
casein and austism:

Casein Peptide (Milk) Appears To Cause Autism-like Behav. Disorders In
Rats (Tuesday, March 30, 1999)

Scientists from the University of Florida in Gainesville believe that
they may have found a link between autism, schizophrenia and
beta-casomorphin-7 (beta-CM7), a small peptide derived from the
breakdown of casein in milk and milk products.

Dr. J. Robert Cade and colleagues report their findings in two papers
in the March issue of the journal Autism.

In the first paper, the team reports that peripheral administration to
rats of human beta-CM7 induced moderate to strong Fos-like
immunoreactivity in regions of the brain previously implicated in
autism and schizophrenia. These included the nucleus accumbens,
caudate putamen and the prefrontal, temporal and occipital cortex.
Pretreatment with naloxone significantly lessened or blocked the
effects of beta-CM7.

The finding, the scientists say, suggests that beta-CM7 "...can cross
the blood-brain barrier, activate opioid receptors and affect brain
regions similar to those affected in schizophrenia and autism."

Dr. Cade and others also observed uptake of beta-CM7 by dopaminergic,
serotonergic and brain gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA) systems in the
rat brain.

Dr. Cade's group says that the findings lend support to the hypothesis
that casein intake may be involved in development of schizophrenia and
autism. Dr. Cade and others have previously observed that patients
with schizophrenia and autism improve significantly when casein is
removed from their diets.

In the second paper, Dr. Cade, with one of the investigators from the
previous study, reports that intravenous administration of beta-CM7
produced analgesic effects as well as "remarkable" behavioral changes
in rats.

These behavioral changes ranged from restlessness "...with teeth
chattering and with rapid respiration..." about a minute after
administration to inactivity and avoidance of other animals 7 minutes
postinjection. The rats were also oblivious to a bell ringing in near
proximity following beta-CM7 administration.

The findings in this particular experiment support the hypothesis that
some of the symptoms of autism and schizophrenia are caused by
"...exorphins produced in the intestine by the digestion of casein and
gluten," Dr. Cade and his colleague conclude.

jaym1212

I am also concerned about pasteurized/homogenized milk. So the lactic
acid producing bacterias only need some type of carb (ie from grains)
and some proteins (from whey) to grow, or can they multiply simply on
carbs?

jaym1212

According to www.wheyoflife.org/facts/proteinchart.html whole eggs are
as good or better source of proteins than whey. Does this look
correct? Why use whey instead of soft boiled eggs?

How can I minimize intake of oxidized cholesterol while meeting daily
protein requirements (ie 100g)? Is the cholesterol in whey products
oxidized? How oxidized is the cholestrol in soft boiled (5 min) eggs?
At what cooking temperature do cholestrols begin to oxidize? Is
exposure to air necessary?

SOURCE___________ QTY ____ PROTEIN _ CHOLESTROL
Pas/homo milk____ 1c _____ 8g ______ 35mg
Metagenics Whey__ 1 serv _ 16g _____ 45mg
Shrimp___________ 100 g __ 20g _____ 152mg
Egg______________ 1 ______ 6g ______ 180mg
Egg white________ 100g ___ 11g _____ 0mg

Based on the above, are egg whites the winner?
Do egg yolks provide any proteins missing from the egg whites?

nick

jaym1212:

I think lactic acid overload is often due to other problems, in other words,


bad news, but eating a little yogurt is fine - though I fear the
homogenization/pasteurization, as previously noted. You might want to get
the book "Nourishing Traditions," which describes all kinds of things you
can eat that have been eaten by humans for thousands of years. They
describe the way you can make various fermented products. Eggs are great,
though I advise eating the organic DHA or omega 3 enhanced ones, as that
displaces some of the arachidonic acid that is normally found in eggs. Eat
the whole egg, not just the whites, but do not cook while exposed to air (so
poached, hard-boiled, or soft-boiled only). However, I was talking about
lactic acid - this is not something relating to eggs, as far as I know.
Yes, eggs are a good source of protein, but cooking it the wrong way could
damage the proteins, such as frying.
jaym1212 posted:
"> ... though I wounld not eat the pasteurized/homogenized stuff. Make your


I am also concerned about pasteurized/homogenized milk. So the lactic
acid producing bacterias only need some type of carb (ie from grains)
and some proteins (from whey) to grow, or can they multiply simply on
carbs?"