charles farley

I already answered you elsewhere in this thread, here's a repost:

Let's say it was zero -- that doesn't change the fact that "There was
not a single agency of the American government that the Soviets had
not infiltrated, ranging from the OSS--the forerunner of the CIA--to
the Justice Department, to the Treasury Department, to the State
Department, to all of the wartime defense agencies."


Nova (PBS Television)
February 5, 2002

"Secrets, Lies, and Atomic Spies"

In 1995, the U.S. National Security Agency broke a half century of
silence by releasing translations of Soviet cables decrypted back in
the 1940s by the Venona Project. Venona was a top-secret U.S. effort
to gather and decrypt messages sent in the 1940s by agents of what is
now called the KGB and the GRU, the Soviet military intelligence
agency. The cables revealed the identities of numerous Americans who
were spies for the Soviet Union.

Ultimately the code breakers found cover names for more than 300
Americans who spied for the Soviets in World War Two.

One who had the cover name "Quantum," provided the Soviets at a very
early stage, the actual scientific formula for separating U-235 from
U-238, which is a very key step in developing a working atomic bomb.

American counterintelligence was able to identify only about 100 of
these Soviet agents.

But even this incomplete list is remarkable: Harry Dexter White,
Assistant Secretary of the Treasury, cover name "Lawyer;" Larry
Duggan, Chief of the Division of American Republics at the State
Department, cover name "Prince;" Lauchlin Currie, Senior
Administrative Assistant to President Roosevelt, cover name "Page."

There was not a single agency of the American government that the
Soviets had not infiltrated, ranging from the OSS--the forerunner of
the CIA--to the Justice Department, to the Treasury Department, to the
State Department, to all of the wartime defense agencies.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/transcripts/2904_venona.html

charles farley

Let's say there was a security risk in the US government code-named
"Quantum" who you could not locate. Are you saying that if you could
not locate "Quantum," you would have no credibility? The success or
failure of your search would not change the fact that there was indeed
a Soviet spy code-named "Quantum" working in the US government, who
did indeed provide America's atomic secrets to the Soviet Union...

lawson english

If you accused dozens of people of being Quantum, and none of them turned
out to be Quantum, it kinda makes you look bad, don't it?


--
New definition of irony:

'Today's liberal Democrats are like the supporters of the Third Reich of the
'30's and '40's
- they absolutely trusted the government to "make things right". '
-Comment made on the internet by an ardent GW Bush supporter.

dana dare

You'd think it would, wouldn't you? Unless, of course, you were
interested in nothing more than covering the... rears of those 'Quantum
hunters' for no other reason than that they could be tied to the methods
used -- even today -- by 'your side'... right?

It'd be funny if it wasn't happening.

--
Usenet: a nice place to visit -- but I wouldn't want to live there.
Dana Dare

gpatton

Billary:
They say birds of a feather flock together.

I checked the web and found out about a book you might want to read.
Below is a part of a review of the book.

Hate: George Lincoln Rockwell and the American Nazi Party
Customer Review #1: Racial Dynamics of Politics

This book is about George Lincoln Rockwell, founder of the American
Nazi Party during the sixties.

This book is interesting because it shows who becomes a Nazi and what
characteristics they have. Rockwell was once a McCarthyite fighting
communism, but after reading some information about the Jewish
influences on communism became a Nazi fighting "Jewish" communism. He
also was not a believer in the ability of a person to become smarter
by the environment they are put in, but thought there was racial
differences to intelligence due to heredity and genetics. He also
could not be manipulated by sentiment easily and did not like novels
such as the G****s of Wrath that allegedly played on peoples emotions
rather than use reason to get its point across. Rockwell was generally
insensitive to what others thought of his views no matter how
unpopular; he ended up sacrificing his financial security and family
to "save the white race".

gpatton

I have always wanted to see the list of all 57 communist that McCarthy
said were in the State Department. Is it on the net?

egk

It would be even more interesting to have someone come up with a single
person whose life was supposedly ruined by McCarthy. Calling someone a
communist isn't much different then half the slander we still get in
politics today.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

"There would be a lot more civility in this world if people
didn't take that as an invitation to walk all over you"
- (Calvin and Hobbes)

jean buridan

EGK allegedly said:

Fifty years ago, it was serious becasue the propaganda fed to Americans then
was about Communism.

Today it's about Osama.

Tomorrow it will be some other thing.....the point being you must always be
afraid so your Feuhrer needs your unwavering support - NO MATTER WHAT.

Sure beats being accountable or taking any notice of the US Constitution.

gpatton

<snip>


Well I can't find the list! I guess Senator Joseph McCarthy took the
list (of names of the 57 communist in the State Department) with him
to the grave, and there were lots of communist (and also the USSR)
that owe McCarthy a debt of gratitude for keeping their names secret.
Had he revealed their identity, they may have not been able to
continue their "work" in the State Department. Yea, McCarthy was a
great man, at least in the eyes of those he refused to expose.

egk

Ahh, so McCarthy is damned if he did and damned if he didn't. We get the
left telling us that McCarty smeared and ruined many lives because he
supposedly branded them as communists. Now we have you telling us that
whoops, he never actually released names and by not doing that, he protected
them instead.

http://www.thenewamerican.com/tna/1996/vo12no18/vo12no18_mccarthy.htm

Exerpts:

Q. Was it fair for McCarthy to make all those names public and ruin
reputations?

A. That is precisely why McCarthy did not make the names public. Four times
during McCarthy's February 20th speech, Senator Scott Lucas demanded that
McCarthy make the 81 names public, but McCarthy refused to do so, responding
that "if I were to give all the names involved, it might leave a wrong
impression. If we should label one man a communist when he is not a
communist, I think it would be too bad." What McCarthy did was to identify
the individuals only by case numbers, not by their names.

By the way, it took McCarthy some six hours to make that February 20th
speech because of harassment by hostile senators, four of whom - Scott
Lucas, Brien McMahon, Garrett Withers, and Herbert Lehman - interrupted him
a total of 123 times. It should also be noted that McCarthy was not
indicting the entire State Department. He said that "the vast majority of
the employees of the State Department are loyal" and that he was only after
the ones who had demonstrated a loyalty to the Soviet Union or to the
Communist Party.

As for his supposed smear of General George Marshall:


Q. What about McCarthy's attack on General George Marshall? Wasn't that a
smear of a great man?

A. This is a reference to the 60,000-word speech McCarthy delivered on the
Senate floor on June 14, 1951 (later published as a book entitled America's
Retreat From Victory). One interesting thing about the speech is that
McCarthy drew almost entirely from sources friendly to Marshall in
discussing nearly a score of Marshall's actions and policies that had helped
the communists in the USSR, Europe, China, and Korea. "I do not propose to
go into his motives," said McCarthy. "Unless one has all the tangled and
often complicated cir***stances contributing to a man's decisions, an
inquiry into his motives is often fruitless. I do not pretend to understand
General Marshall's nature and character, and I shall leave that subject to
subtler ****ysts of human personality."

One may agree or disagree with McCarthy's statement that America's steady
retreat from victory "must be the product of a great conspiracy, a
conspiracy on a scale so immense as to dwarf any previous such venture in
the history of man. A conspiracy of infamy so black that, when it is finally
exposed, its principals shall be forever deserving of the maledictions of
all honest men." That statement was very controversial in 1951, but after
no-win wars in Korea and Vietnam, decades of Soviet expansionism throughout
the world, the weakening of America's military, and its increasing
subservience to United Nations authority, it doesn't seem so controversial
anymore.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

"There would be a lot more civility in this world if people
didn't take that as an invitation to walk all over you"
- (Calvin and Hobbes)