kathryn

I really would hate to state the obvious.....but here I go.....you seem
to have little or no understanding of alternative religions here....and
by alternative I mean Buddhism. Buddhists do not worship the Buddha
('enlightened one') they follow his example and his teachings, they do
not believe he is a God in the judeo-christian sense of the word, he did
not create the world, it was there already and why worry about that. Let
the past be, you cannot change it. (BTW my soon to be husband is an
ex-Theravada Buddhist teaching monk....and entitled to call himself
Buddha too.......)

love peace joy in your heart

day brown

Gimbutas also noted however, that had the Vinca, Petresti, & Cucuteni
been conquered by the patriarchic Kurgans, it was the slowest invasion
ever. Took hundreds of years to wipe it all out.

My own theory is that the Kurgans, the first to domesticate the horse,
must've experienced a drought on the Ukrainian steppe at some point, and
it would only be natural for them to go down into Rumania and the
Hungarian plain....

Bringing something like Anthrax with them. On the Steppe, no big deal;
the germs get left behind for years or decades before the nomads return
to the same place; but for an agarian fixed stock breeding culture,
disastrous.

Then too, *after* the initial contact, the Kurgans quit building mounds
for their chiefs for a millennia. *they* were replaced by the
matriarchic Cucuteni on the Asian steppes because, prior to the
invention of the Stirrup, it was only the women who could ride in the
furious chaos of Amazonian battle without having a nut crushed on the
back bone of the early, small, horses they then had.

They didnt get wiped out for millennia, but we still see the
matriarchies in the Tocharians of NW China up until 1500 years ago, when
they, and everyone, got wiped out by hordes of Mongols... who had an
extremely good series of years on the Steppe, multiplied like rabbits,
then when the drought came again, spilled across all the civilized
nations.

wabond

Hi Day Brown

I have never heard of the Tocharians matriachy in China. Do you have
the name of the book or the url where you got this infomation?

William Bond

resurrect isis

<Sme polite snips here to keep the file size down>


C'mon, Bond, everybody knows Adam started the human race without the service of a womb.
<snip>

Ancient men didn't have college degrees. Of course they were too stupid to
figure out that what they put in the hole had something to do with what came
out of it. It took white, male, European, Christian, scientists to figure
out what caused babies.
<snip>


The early agrarian civilizations were relatively peaceful and settled
communities that had settled near permanent water supplies on the best
available land. They were all under more or less continuous raids from the
more warlike hunting tribes from the surrounding "badlands." As the climate
of western Asia got dryer and droughts got more severe, the raiding became
more intense and serious. So, much of the "violence to

I think Day Brown would go along with that. The Younger Dryas event would
fit this scenerio, but I don't know if the date is right. rxss

day brown

Elizabeth Barber, archaeo fabrics expert, 'The Mummies of Urumchi'
JP Mallory, well known archaeological scholar, "The Tarim Mummies"

http://www.titus.kidg1.uni-frankfurt.de/texte/tocharic/tht.htm
if I got it right, should show you samples of their writing, which
Mallory, for one, notes looks like old Gothic.

Written with a goose quill on parchement or even birch bark, found in
the Tarim basin towns of what is now NW china.
The Birch bark grows in Europe. Barber shows the fabrics, woven in
classic European twill, of european sheep (according to the DNA) in
plaid, and even tartan. 1500+ years old.

gil shea

humans during the Stone Age, they were surprised to discovered in carved statues
and wall paintings there was far more images of women than men.

This is true examine your history, NEFFERTTI was the ATON (ATONE)
She who became one in the perfect body, and took the throne as "The King of
Man".
Her followers are known as the SHI or SHE-A, the tribe of the descendants.
Bush is right somebody has "Hijacked a Religion", but he is not trying to invoke
the "Universal Incantation to restore ORDER to CHAOS", he is invoking the
incantation of the thousand points of light.
This is the invocation of CHAOS, the Forbidden act.
It is the Incantation to bring the iron will of the Architect to bear on the
people.
This is not Heaven on Earth, but a return to pagan, and Feudal ways.
It is prohibited under the laws given by Ackhnotitin, the OUR FATHER.

I like it the only religion which can prove what it say's and has a true history
are the liar's, those who struggle in blind faith are the truth, and all who
disagree agree must die.

The tribe of Seth exceeds any religions basis, the children of Ackhnotitin and
Neffertti are the Faerie or the followers of Faeroe.
They are the ones driven from Egypt.
They are the ones who first brought the idea of "THE ONE GOD" the the people.
Man begged God for a King and God gave them one Ackhnotitin.
He gave the world the teachings of the "ATONE", the God gave of itself to heal
the wounds of the separation of the body.


Really?
How?
The TEachings I read say the ADAM was first made in the Image of the ONE.
That the ONE left and when it returned it found all but man had propagated, so
it separated the body male and female.
This was a mistake.
It led to the sins and the Murders of the Body.
The One was compelled to give of itself to trey to stop the breach.
Do you knot understand.

gil shea

Nope wrong URL

wabond

The Ancient Great Mother

When palaeontologists and archaeologists began to discover the remains
of humans during the Stone Age, they were surprised to discovered in
carved statues and wall paintings there was far more images of women
than men. At first they didn’t take the feminine images
seriously and female statuettes were routinely discarded as just
fertility images or Stone Age ****ography. It was only because some
people in the art world got interested in these statuettes that we
know about them today. As palaeontologists found they had a
profitable sideline in selling female statuettes to art dealers.

The surprise of scientists that Stone-Age people seemed to be more
interested in making images of women rather than men has a lot to do
with the Judeo-Christian attitudes. For the last two thousand years
it has been accepted by the main religions of Christianity, Islam,
Buddhism and to some degree Hinduism that god is a male. So we have
then been so brainwashed into believing this, that it is hard for us
to think of a Creator that is not a male. Including it seems
scientists whom many profess to being unbiased and logical atheists.

Yet it was not always like this and from the evidence coming from the
Stone and Neolithic Ages, it seems people then naturally assume our
Creatix was a women.
It seems that when humans first became self aware they began to ask
themselves, “what created the world?” It then would be
natural for them to assume that the intelligence that created our
world would be feminine. Because if we look at animal and human life,
we find that life is created within the bodies of females. In fact
it must of seem to our ancestors that women had great magical powers
to create life like this. So it would be logical for them to assume
that the whole of creation was born from the body of what they called,
“The Great Mother”.

This belief it seems gave women great power and status in human
societies. Because if the Creatrix was female then all women were
created in the image of the Great Mother. This then made women very
sacred and holy because it was only women who could create in the same
way the Great Mother had done. This is seen clearly in the many
images found in Stone Age and Neolithic sites that show images of the
***-act, the genitalia of women represented as V or slit symbols and
the very many ***** images of women themselves. The picture that
comes from these ancient times is that people then regarded the
***-act, menstruation, child-birth and breast feeding as all being
very sacred. Because they were all part of the process of creating
life.

Some palaeontologists have speculated that people in the Stone Age
were unaware that the *** act produced childbirth. So women suddenly
producing children would be seen as a wondrous miracle where men had
no input. They also went on to imagine that when men realised this
role in conception, he no longer worshipped women as magical beings
and took over the role of Creator himself. To support this theory we
do find in Ancient Egypt that the God Atum created the world in a act
of ************. The problem is that we do find the ***ual act
portrayed in Stone-Age art. So the people then, may not be as
ignorant as we assume they might be. Also the input of men in the act
of creation can be over in two seconds, (wham, bam, thank you
ma’am). Which is not anywhere equal to women carrying a foetus
for nine months and the pain and drama of childbirth itself. As well
as the ability of the women to feed the new born baby from her
breasts. Not to mention all the mysteries of menstrual, which was
seen as something very holy and sacred in matriarchal societies, and
something as unclean and taboo in later patriarchal societies.

So we can see from this that the ancient religion of the Great Mother
would be a very feminine religion and empathise the feminine virtues
of compassion, caring, nurturing, loving and creativity. This is
supported by the fact that in the first civilisations of the Neolithic
age, warfare and violence against other people was completely unknown.
Archaeologists only begin to find weapons of war, fortifications and
images of violence in the later bronze and iron ages. Where it seems
people began to worship male warrior gods. According to the
Archaeologists Marija Gimbutas the peaceful Neolithic civilizations
were conquered by male violence. Where war lords used violence to
conquer and enslave people and create the patriarchal world we now
know for the last five thousand years.

William Bond

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DivineGoddess

nita byrd

I enjoyed this piece William. Thanks for posting this theme, it is
important! (I couldn't get into the website you gave, since it was
restricted for me? My older son, the PC whiz, must be meddling around my
settings again What caught my attention is the idea that for me holds a
great deal of intuitive truth--why the original maternal power, mystery and
creator goddess gradually gave way to patriarchal might, conquest by brute
strength, and male creator gods.

BTW, I recently read a wonderful novel with a good feel of the Dark Ages
with emphaisis on the reality of ruthless raids on everyone and
anyone--complete and savage lawlessness. At the same time there's a theme
of a "witch" woman that gives a realistic portrait of what it might have
been like to be one in those times, before the Inquisition. It was
interesting for me to note that you were as much born into the role as you
learned the skills. The book is _The Pillars of the Earth_ by Ken Follett
and has been an international best seller. It's main theme that gathers the
entire colorful cast of 12th Century characters is the building of a
magnificent cathedral along with sub-themes of suspense. You'll the love
the strength of the witch, who grabs the attention of the reader throughout.
The mother-complexed ambitios knight was memorable also and expresses that
element of "might makes right" and how someone like him must tick behind the
exterior surfaces--he was highly fearful of being sent to hell, for example,
and this motivated his behavior, albeit in the extreme, and as it affected
so many in those times held in the grip of religion and superstition. I
loved this book--a great epic if you're interested in getting immersed in a
trance world of life-like people with human emotions that are believable.

The roots of patriarchal domination began when men found out that woman
wasn't the magical and powerful creator without their input We do seem to
be getting closer in the new millennium to deflecting the negativity through
our raised consciousness, which is not yet apparent in the current war
against terrorism. The Inkas have long predicted a "pacakuta" or major
change in consciousness toward a higher level about this time. So some
Andean Priests today say that the current upheavel will lead to the
possibility of higher plane of spiritual consciousness. I think that out of
the phoenix of instability rises the promise of a higher level of spiritual
consciousness that may prevail if we strive to use our own discernment and
good judgment. It all begins with one.

I guess I'll believe in a significant step toward equality of the ***es when
a woman is elected president in my country, the USA! (Not that it means
anything to me other than may the best person win the election--if the
"best" is a woman, so be it I saw a Sci-Fi movie the other night which
was amusing, since a group of women sometime in the future put an infectious
disease in the water, to affect males, but not women. So it killed off most
of the men, or made them sterile, I can't remember exactly. As it goes
though, a few men remained because of immunity to the infection. Jumping to
the point: *the women for the most part acted every bit as power hungry as
had the very men they'd killed off*. So put the shoe on the other foot and
it still fits.

Here is one way I think we can move forward from those eons of ancient
goddess creation religions and woman's power, and past patriarchal
domination, to a world view that values each child born as no sinner, but on
the contrary, as an _innocent and sacred human being_. The Christian notion
of each child born a "sinner" must change... to each child is born an
"innocent". This notion doesn't negate Christianity, it will make it
better. What do you say, too idealistic? If a Baptist minister in N.C.
recently married a *** couple, it would seem to me that throwing out
original sin to be replaced with original innocence is entirely possible
With acceptance of this idea of the sacredness of human birth, embracing
both genders, the emphasis is not on WHO has the power, but focuses on the
child. We each hold the ability NOW to choose the wiser and discerning
perspective for recognizing the sacredness of the innocent human at
conception. Like the flower seed that evolves in natural stages from
germination, rooting in Mother Earth, taking in the sun, wind, and water
spirits to reach it's final potential in the bloom, I believe it is time for
us to abandon the idea of "original sin" and see the truth of what really
is. This idea is derived of what I've discovered over the years about Inka
mystic-shamanism and the Andean spiritual traditions.

Original sin concept has given too many people life-long fears of their own
nature. It has put the emphasis on reward seeking in an afterlife, rather
than making sure one lives a good life here, for it's own sake. We do
create whether this life IS heaven or not once we know that happiness isn't
something that we depend upon "out there", but is nurtured about loving and
viewing ourselves as sacred human beings. To be raised in the religious
climate of "we are all sinners" results in the diminishing of the natural
happiness for life built into man and womankind from the very beginning.
What is the phrase that one hears so often bantered about, "Innocent until
proven guilty"? I ask about the concept of "original innocence"--could it
be a new guiding force in one's outlook, regardless of religious or
spiritual beliefs, transcending power struggles between men and women?

Munay, which means "love and beauty through creative choice" according to my
Peruvian spiritual mentor, Juan Nunez del Prado.

Nita