clothaire

snip

K-Man said that atheism is absurd.

That means that he believes in all of the 15,000 gods.

Such heresy will confine him to Hell for ever. Clothaire #1392

mark k. bilbo

Actually, I believe he's a fundamentalist agnostic.

No, really. We don't appear to have any business not believing, we're
supposed to be going around saying "duh, I dunno."
--
Mark K. Bilbo #1423 EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
__________________________________________________ ______________
"...lying is central to the survival of nations and to the
success of great enterprises, because if our enemies can
count on the reliability of everything you say, your
vulnerability is enormously increased."

- Michael Ledeen, neo-con leader

alex

On 26 Jul 2003 20:16:35 GMT, Dwight Dominus <dwight_dominus@yahoo.com>


As far as there are "proven facts" in science (everything is always up
for revision or the trash if something better comes along) - a long
time ago. Evolution by natural selection has more evidence and
observations going for it than the theory of gravity (only something
like the germ theory of disease has more corroborating evidence).

michael painter

It should be pointed out that as soon as somebody says "proven fact" when
dealing with science it is almost a one hundred percent certainty that they
do *not* understand what a scientific theory is.

Things are proven in math and defenestration but not in theory.

dwight dominus

Oh really? I suppose if it's as knowable "as far as we can know
anything scientifically", you should be able to explain to me
the precise sequence of steps natural selection took in producing,
say, the human eye, as accurately as a space dynamicist could
explain how to get a rocket to the moon?

--
Dwight Dominus

alex

On 27 Jul 2003 12:58:58 GMT, Dwight Dominus <dwight_dominus@yahoo.com>

Nice technique:
"I climbed all the way up to the top of the Empire State Building!"
"I don't believe you - how many steps were there?"
"Uh, I didn't count them-"
"I knew it! The Empire State Building doesn't exist!"

Sorry, it doesn't work that way. We don't need to know all the steps
to know that there were steps. We see many intermediate forms in other
animals - which proves that the intermediate forms *do* have a
function that is selectable.

Obviously, we're not going to find the intermediate forms in the
ground because eyes are soft tissue that will rot (or are eaten) long
before they're able to be fossilized. To be able to really challenge
evolution by natural selection you need to show that there are *no*
sequences, of human body functions/forms, in evidence - and especially
those that *can* be fossilized. That, my friend is the difficult task
creationists aren't up for. The best they can do vs the plethora of
skulls, hands, feet, or just whole skeletons is, "They had rickets!"
Right, every person that ever lived thousands of years ago, that ended
up fossilized, had rickets.

dwight dominus

Really? You know, this could save me a whole lot of work for the
next paper I'm going to write! I can just leave out a bunch of
steps from my proofs, and, when the referee asks, I'll just tell
him, "Hey, we don't need to know all the steps to know that there
were steps! We both know my results are true 'as far as we can know anything scientifically'."


But, I thought we knew, "as far as we can know anything scientifically",
that humans evolved by natural selection? Why can't we demonstrate how
the selection is applied, and show that "intermediate forms" are, indeed,
intermediate forms, and not just some sub-species that died out?

--
Dwight Dominus

john baker

Evolution is fact. Creationism is bullshit. Learn it, live it, ****ing deal
with it.

michael painter

Sorry John. Creationism is not bullshit.
Bullshit has some value.

michael painter

Sorry John. Creationism is not bullshit.
Bullshit has some value.