Spiritual Transformation

< snip >

Yep. IMO an experience that one has had oneself tends to be more
meaningful than one that someone else has had. Perhaps hundreds,
or thousands, of years ago.

Regards, John.

< snip >

IMO you have hit on one of the major strengths of Spiritualism as
opposed to some other religion. It doesn't rely on "sacred books".
People are encouraged to question and think for themselves. Not
blindly quote some sort of "scripture".

Spiritualism tends to try and unify beliefs/people from multiple
religious persuasions. Orthodox religions however tend to
create/encourage differences.

Regards, John.

Well, one may hurt a lot of other people in our quest for "joy". The
point of incarnation is spiritual growth. That may, or may not, involve any joy.

"Teachings" of any sort can also be incorrectly translated into other languages and/or misinterpreted.

Being a "business" isn't IMO necessarily "bad". It's what that
business does that is the important thing.

Orthodox churches have long been about "controlling" people. "Do as we
say or you are damned". Fortunately Spiritualist philosophy isn't like that.

Good. Nice to know it is available somewhere else than in Germany.

Your English is much better than my French. :-)

Regards, John.

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< snip >

No easier IMO. Our sins don't need to be "f****ven" in the first
place. If we do wrongs then we need to right them. In Spiritualist
philosophy this is termed "karma".
< snip >

Regards, John.

--
************************************************** **
,-._|\ John Fitzsimons - Melbourne, Australia.
/ Oz \ http://www.vicnet.net.au/~johnf/welcome.htm
\_,--.x/ http://clients.net2000.com.au/~johnf/
v

I still find strong correlation between the teachings of Jesus and
spiritualism, but I think most people in churches close their ears to the
true teaching and churches can have their own agendas
someone wrongs me and I develop hatred toward them I regonize this hatred
in my heart and I f****ve them and it clears my heart of hatred
I wrong someone in the past I ask God to f****ve my sins
and lead a righteous life and my heart is cleared of sin
In order to be f****ven you must f****ve isn't this "Karma"
Jim

< snip >

Fine. That's what you are meant to do.

No, it isn't. One doesn't need to ask God to f****ve sins. That is an
idea that church authorities thought up to get people dependent on
them. "Going to confession" is not karma.

The soul needs to learn from it's actions. It does so by experiencing
the sort of things it did to others and/or by reversing the actions.
Specifically and/or in general.

"Your sins are f****ven" simply means that "your karma has been
cleared". Not by some priest, or God, "f****ving" anything but by
the completion of the learning experience.

Regards, John.

--
************************************************** **
,-._|\ John Fitzsimons - Melbourne, Australia.
/ Oz \ http://www.vicnet.net.au/~johnf/welcome.htm
\_,--.x/ http://clients.net2000.com.au/~johnf/
v

But doesn't God determine if what you do is sufficient to clear your karma?
So it's up to him if it gets cleared or not (in my opinion).
Christian religion believes that f****veness comes with true repentance,
which is basically clearing your karma. Also you seem to believe that
when a person dies all the wrongs he did in the world (his bad karma),
goes away with him. But there is sufficient evidence that it remains
until some actions are taken by someone to balance it, or clear it.

As I mentioned above, there is sufficient evidence that wrongs that
people committed in the world will continue to affect people long
after that person has died. So praying to God to f****ve the sins
of others in the world is necessary. For example in extreme cases
this is clearly felt, such as houses where a violent murder has occurred.
Sensitive people living in that house will continue to feel that oppression
for years afterwards, unless some action is taken, like praying, which
seems to act to clear that concentration of energy that was ac***ulated
as a result of that action.

Ronald

Hi Ronald,

karma?

In most spiritual traditions, God is not thought of in the same way as the
Christian religion. In most spiritual paths, God is all of nature, the
process of life. Karma is a law of nature (God), and is held by to the
induvidual, and is therfore up to them to remove.

From a spiritualits perspective, repentance is for the sinner, not because
God is keeping a score card and requires one to remain at par. Even in the
Christian religion, repentance isn't a resolve required by God, it's a tool
availible for the karma bearer. The natural order is free will, hold onto or
remove the karmas, existance doesnt care.

I think it's very dangerous to go mixing things like that. Since Buddhism
is one of the most populated of the world's religions, and does not have a
concept that equates to the Judeo-Christian God at all, it's misleading to
say that they have that concept in a different form. They don't.

I am currently a follower of Taoism. In my view, to the extend that "God"
exists, he's a powerful, vengeful spirit who laid a claim on some of the
most valuable real estate in the world, a claim that various peoples keep
trying to enforce in his name.

The different religions of the world are different to each other. Saying
that "God's f****veness" is the same as "clearing your karma" is like saying
that a fork is essentially the same as a pair of chopsticks. While there is
some truth in the comparison, the opportunity to learn how to use either
tool properly is taken away if you shrug your shoulders and say that they
are the same. Nick

Hello Nick,

I agree, however, Buddhism is a philosophy, not religion. No belief in god
is neccissary (according to Gotima) though some sects have some forms of
diety worship. Buddhism doesnt event neccissarily recognize the western
concept of a spirit, some would question if it is a spiritual path at all.

They may or may not be the same, some would argue. The goal, however, is
transcendental bliss from suffering, fear, illusion caused from karmas
(sin). Whether the individual transcend their evil sin through a savior or
transcend their karma debit via neutralizing the energy. Transcendental
bliss is the common result from the common conditions. It can be fairly
easily shown that these terms/techniques are identical. The difference
would be philosophical, the point isn't which philosophy won, the point is
no philosophy is needed. Dissolve the questioner and no questions arise.
If no questions exist, all is peace. Then we can witness, wu-wei. The
opportunity is to learn from the tools proper use, as you point out. No
dissection is needed on either account, that was part of the point to the
contradictory post.

The goal of transcendental bliss is defined in many processes, from many
aspects, by many people. The process (experience) cannot be quantified,
which is the intent. I practice kundalini kriya tantra and jnani yoga which
is the yogic sciences of energy manipulation (mind over matter). The
transcendental experience is defined completely different in those systems
as well. The practice is even different, yet the goals are the same. In
most cases, teachers of paths discourage dissecting its mechanics. Instead
the advice is to practice it and discover the results realized. It cannot
be defined, the name of a thing is not the thing, just as the word 'Light'
printed on a book does not reveal the books contents in the dark.

David

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1 16th January 10:50 john fitzsimons External User Posts: 1	Spiritual Transformation < snip > Yep. IMO an experience that one has had oneself tends to be more meaningful than one that someone else has had. Perhaps hundreds, or thousands, of years ago. Regards, John.