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1 19th March 21:50
rave
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Default Effect of Bryant's contretemps on Laker Revenue (speculation)


I am a christian (one of those dread calvinists), and in the past, I have
seen Christian boycotts change the face of television. I am assuming that
alot of companies (who have to answer to consumers for their stance on media
issues) will not wish to be seen supporting more violence in the NBA.

With regard to my theory, Patricia's site doesn't carry run ins with the
law, and the crackhead site appears to be the only place it is do***ented.
in one place.

Rave
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2 19th March 21:50
terraholm
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Default Effect of Bryant's contretemps on Laker Revenue (speculation)


My condolances. =)

Yeah you can tell by how the programing has progressed over the last few decades....


Supporting violance? This is America....Only thing Kobe is known guilty of
so far is cheating on his wife and being dumber than a fence post in doing
so.
Secondly Kobe is not the team. Why should 11 other guys and the organization
be boycotted for the actions of one player?
Shaq is a reserve police officer, should we not then tune in to support
that? Malone is a NRA red neck republican....

Are you not the guy that for 2 seasons has talked about supporting the
blazers since the sonics have disappointed you?

What theory would that be? Does SA get good ratings? Bible thumping NYNs? Or
does Iverson and Kidd get plenty of love?

Pretty hard to find a team not represented there with past or present
players.
Blazers are known as the bad crew, Sac has just as many potheads....what
teams get the most national coverage? Kobes arrest was before the scedule
was set and yet they skipped the champion spurs for the Xmas day game and
put in the lakers. Now do you really think they are dumb about what team
will get the audience?


--
Laurel T
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by rulers as useful."
Lucius Seneca
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3 25th March 10:07
rave
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Default Effect of Bryant's contretemps on Laker Revenue (speculation)


Well, there are a lot of reality TV shows now.

O.J. was found not guilty by a jury of his peers. People all over the
country still count him as guilty. The reality of what is going on is that
Kobe's reputation is now sullied, and his rep may never recover. The
appearance of guilt can turn off advertisers. They seem to be a picky bunch.

Kobe's impact on the NBA and the fact that he WAS a FAN FAVORITE cannot be
measured. Just as Mark Cuban says the impact will be higher ratings, I say
certain advertisers may avoid the entire situation by not advertising during NBA programs.


Not 2 seasons, I dislike the new management and stated in the Blazer group
within the last month that I am now supporting the Blazers.


The theory you and I were discussing in the Laker NG about violence in the
NBA. You pointed me to several web sites. Perhaps your memory has failed,
or you have such a thing going on for KOBE my saying anything anti-Kobe made
you lose your mind.

Does SA get good ratings? Bible thumping NYNs? Or


In my opinion, the NBA is full of jocks who went through college on special
treatment and
I could care less about their personal lives.


The NBA has a history of ignoring "violence in the NBA". The "team not
represented" was not the subject of our discussion before you lost your
mind. Has violence and/or criminal behavior in the NBA increased in recent
years?

Rave
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4 25th March 10:07
terraholm
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Default Effect of Bryant's contretemps on Laker Revenue (speculation)


And they show the christian influence how?

This is not a double murder where we know there is a victim. Dead people do
not invent the crime, sometimes that is not so in **** cases.

Perhaps a lot of people have prejudged Kobe either way, but when it comes to
making money I doubt most advertising executives will put suspicion over
ratings when assigning advertising dollars.All the publicity will have
people who never watched basketball tuning in.

For any avoiding the lakers others will fill in. It is not just Kobe's
endor*****ts. Would you not look at the likely high ratings as a gold mind
if
you were using Shaq and other players in your commercials?

hmmm, I could swear and I bet google, you saying so last year and it lasted
about a week or so. =)
You do understand the blazers are the team that actually have a convicted
rapist?
The portland media get more mileage out of pot or refusing to sign an autograph...

failed,

Oh I was supposed to read your mind on the reference to a thread from the lakers group.... =)

Excuse me? If I do not prejudge someone as guilty from rumor and media hype
in a serious criminal case I am blind?


You were saying the christians will influence the ratings. Why have they not
already done so since you see violence as a nba problem? Since there are so
many of them why do not the goody-two-shoe teams have the best ratings? SA
have guys that graduated and nba sportsmanship and Kennedy award winners and
not street guys as stars . Why did their rating plummet after the Dallas
series? Perhaps because the are good but damn boring?


How many "violent felony crimes" have nba players been involved in? How many
convicted? Kobe is a maybe. Two other ex-nba players I can think of, and
one of those has not yet been convicted.
Out of how many players in the league over the last 10 years?

Find me any other group of a thousand men that you can not find cases of
misdemeanor bar fights and domestic abuse. The LA police force may have as
many....

As for within the sport, Sprewell was suspended a year and lost 12 million
dollars, how big a fine would he got for the same offense in a court?


At least I did not lose it in tunnel vision...


I do not think so, in the new world of 24/7 news and sports coverage it just
gets more attention.

As for the NBA not caring you need to rethink it's policy on violence
compared to other sports. Automatic suspensions on or off the court and for
even leaving the bench.

Fighting during games has not been ignored since 1977, that year before the
Kermit/Rudy near manslaughter the game was going the way of hockey. Every
team had an enforcer and some game every night contained a major fight. 80
some that year that involved ejections and there was no automatic ejection
for throwing a punch.
Far from ignoring it they have worked hard on preventing fights with the
heavy penalties, automatic suspensions and the rule stopping bench clearing
brawls.


--
Laurel T
"I hate to do it, but I have to give Smitty
some credit for his defense.
Steve did a nice job of yelling for help every time Cliff
got the ball." DRob on guarding Uncle Cliffy
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5 25th March 10:07
rave
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Default Effect of Bryant's contretemps on Laker Revenue (speculation)


snip

There is less "drugs, *** and rock and roll" on tv. For awhile, everything
looked like MTV in the 80's. Then, people got sick of it, and "family
values" became the buzz word. Does Kobe Bryant's "adultry" (sorry if that's
spelled wrong, I understand that today is the day the virus takes over the
internet, and http://www.dictionary.com is not responding.) reflect "family
values"?

guilty

do


THe mindset that permits people to disbelieve a jury is the issue here.
There are people who are going to say, "he's guilty, his money got him off."
It's a fact of life.


to


Probably there will be a lot of them, but, in the years to come, are people
going to write letters to companies and say "Kobe does not reflect the
values I am trying to instill in my children. I will boycott your company
until you stop advertising during laker programs."


support

be

see above.

group

lasted


I did not post in any newsgroup last season. Go ahead, search google, try
finding the post from 3 years ago where I broke down Shammond Williams' lack
of defense. A lot of my posts did not get archived,


Yes, I understand that Ruben has an alford plea for a nanny **** charge.
After reading the CBA, I understand that the applicable law in handing out
penalities is NOT the state of washington. In the State of Washington, the
nanny **** cannot be used against him.

Hmm.... you don't suppose they understand what an alford plea is?

the


Umm... sorry, I thought you might remember several posts.


hype


Why can't you give Ruben the same treatment, oh yeah, in the Laker NG you
said it was probably because you don't like him.


not

so


and

I said, I have seen Christian Boycotts change t.v , and there are a lot of
people out there who think roll models for young children should be above
reproach, and it is possible those people are having an impact. BRI dropped
this year, even with the 24% increase in Broadcasting revenue. Is it
possible that people want more out of roll models for their children. Oh
yeah, a theory I spouted in the Blazar NG, does being explosive off the
court have an correlation with being explosive on the court?


potheads....what

team

That is what I am trying to find out.

How many


NBA Players who are active number about 450.


In mundania, he would have been fired and charged with assault.


just


Well, you have an opinion. I am trying to factually ascertain whether or
not that is a fact.


for


See above.

the

In the 60's and early 70's the big deal was to go to a hockey game to see
the fight. I don't believe the violence was that "accepted" in the NBA,
although I only saw a couple of Blazer games and a couple of Laker games
(can't remember off hand who they played).

Rave


clearing
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6 25th March 10:07
ron coscorrosa
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Default Effect of Bryant's contretemps on Laker Revenue (speculation)


By what measure?


And that's all it is, a buzz word. Look into the private lives of those
espousing family values to see what validity it holds. It's a crock.

Sure. If by family values you mean values many families hold, and
infidelity is certainly common enough, so I would consider that a family value.

This would only be relevant had the entire ****ing trial not been
televised, it was, so in essence, the public were jurors in a superficial
sense (in every way except the important one: handing out the verdict).
Obviously some information was available to the public that wasn't to the
jurors, but it's not as if the entire trial was bathed in anonymity.

It's a fact of the US judicial system, where the best lawyers are
expensive. Now, if you are innocent, and rich, you would be stupid not to
hire the best lawyers you could afford. Being rich doesn't imply guilt.

Yes, because the public really cares about the morality, perceived or
otherwise, of athletes. This is why Mike Tyson never drew a crowd.

And that's a case where the individual itself is responsible, in Kobe's
case, if he was found guilty, he would only be one player on a team, and
not a reflection of the team itself.

Advertisers care about money, that's it. PR is only a small portion of
what factors into their decisions, and when it does, it's because of it's
financial impact and nothing else.


Um, that's not her point. Her point is that you are supporting the
Blazers who have a CONVICTED rapist on their roster, while saying you
wouldn't support the Lakers, even though Kobe's case has not been brought
to trial, and his guilt or innocence not determined.

The Portland media doesn't know it's ass from the hole in the ground, and
that differentiates from other media in no way whatsoever.

An alford plea means Ruben thought he would get convicted, but would
rather not plead guilty, because then people like you couldn't defend him
as easily.

And, FWIW, it's adultery regardless, and a good Calvinist like yourself
should be against such things (even though it's part of the Divine Plan,
but we won't get into a religious debate here (not until Big Chris shows up anyway)).


No, there's a difference between Kobe and Ruben, one has gone to trial,
one has not, one has been convicted, the other hasn't.

This isn't a subtle difference.


Yes, you've said so numerous times. What's your evidence? Examples? Anything?


Correlation doesn't equal causation, even though you'd have a hard time
proving to me that the NBA "roll" models of today are engaged in more
illicit activities than those when the NBA was at it's peak popularity.
Hell, you'd have a hard time convincing me that the NBA, at any period,
had more criminal activity than the rest of the population/workforce in
general (look up which countries in the world have the highest
incarceration rates, if you don't believe me).


OK, find her a group of 450 randomly chosen men then, hell, I'll even
restrict your choices to those who have extreme family values, like
Catholic Priests for example.

Well, that's nice.

Well, before you do, tell me how "Christian Boycotts" have changed the
face of television, by way of actual evidence.

<snip>

--
Ron Coscorrosa
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7 25th March 10:07
rave
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Default Effect of Bryant's contretemps on Laker Revenue (speculation)


the measure being what i see or perhaps what I watch. during the 80's and
early 90's, I found it difficult if not impossible to find alot of things to
watch. I don't have that problem now, but of course, there are a lot more
tv channels to pick from, so it is possible that I just don't watch a lot of it.


Maybe, but the families I know who support the whole "family values" thing
don't sleep around. There was an article in the times recently about a
couple who didn't have premarital ***, and it pointed out that they are
probably in the minority except at their church.

For the record, I don't hold an opinion one way or the other about Kobe's
guilt or innocence. However, in support of the American justice system
(which is flawed), I try to think of OJ as innocent, he was not convicted by a jury.

As for supporting a CONVICTED rapist, in the state of washington it is
possible to plead guilty while not admitting guilt, thereby precluding a
guilty plea being used to enrich the alleged victim. It's called an
"Alford Plea". In line with my trying to support a flawed judicial system,
I am giving Ruben Patterson the benefit of the doubt. If the choice is to
get fined and suspended for a games, or going to trial, being found guilty
of **** (with the same penalties imposed by the NBA) and losing everything
to the nanny in her law suit for damages, I would pick the alford plea.

I never said that I wouldn't support the Lakers because of Koby. I think
that the NBA is in trouble because of all the bad press. I merely said that
the end result may be loss of advertising revenue to the broadcast channels
carrying Laker games and I wished them luck in negotiating their next broadcast contract.


I am against such things, even though I appear to be a minority. See above.


I'm sorry, Ruben did not go to trial, he went to court and entered an alford Plea.


Good point. A few bad apples spoil it for everyone. I'm trying to find out
if there is any correlation between violence in the NBA and declining
revenues. And it's something that causes a lot of controversy. I used to
listen to Wilt Chamberlin (spelling may be wrong) how bout Wilt the Stilt
games, on the radio in a small town in nowheresville, USA. I read on a web
site recently where one of his mistresses quoted him as saying he had slept
with something like 200,000 women. That was before the ***ual revolution of
the 60's, and the press kept things like that from the general population.
So, we go back to my original question, has violence and, yes, immorality
in the NBA increased and what effect is it having on revenues?

your

or

I will start researching that very thing. As I stated above it might be my
choices have increased because of more channels, and not an objective thing.
I'll let you know if and when I find out if I am right or wrong.

Rave
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8 25th March 10:07
jason michael barker
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Default Effect of Bryant's contretemps on Laker Revenue (speculation)


Not to mention, some of these reality TV shows -- Temptation Island, for
example, which seeks to break up couples -- aren't exactly of the highest
moral standard.


--
Jason Michael Barker
http://ussmariner.blogspot.com
Exclusive home of the Big Board and the Future Forty
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9 25th March 10:07
rave
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Default Effect of Bryant's contretemps on Laker Revenue (speculation)


The one I watch is The Great Race, and they have a married homo***ual couple
on it. As long as there ain't no kissing, I try not to judge, you know the
bible and "let him who is without sin cast the first stone." I ain't perfect. Rave
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10 25th March 10:07
ron coscorrosa
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Default Effect of Bryant's contretemps on Laker Revenue (speculation)


In other words, as long as there's kissing.


And neither is God, creating these heathen homo***uals, who have no right
to exist even though He put them there.

Speaking of casting stones:
http://www.discover.com/aug_03/featscienceof.html

38 bounces. Wow.

Also, could God make a stone so heavy that he couldn't skip it?

--
Ron Coscorrosa
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