fsogol

Good news. Spend the dollars on a legit lead off hitter.

--
FSogol

randolph

Exactly. Just seeing this phony would have curdled my stomach. When I
think of that HR race between him and that big goon McGuire and then
Bonds I want to puke. May their records and legacies forever be
tainted.
Them and any other phony that enhanced his stats through substances. I
hope none of them ever enter the Hall of Fame unless they buy a ticket.
It's the only way any of them would have gotten in without steroids.

rufref

I agree with you 100%. People are going to argue with you about McGuire and
Bonds, but it is a false argument. Also, notice how Bonds is not in the
Baseball Classic. Apparently the drug testing is more comprehensive than
what MLB does. Hmmmmmm.

randolph

All people need to do is go to basbeballreference.com and check out the
age comparisions on Bonds.
Through age 32 which is the normal prime age, the players he is most
closely compared to are, Brunansky, Luzinski, his dad, Shawn Green,
Jack Clark and Duke Snider.
Snider is the only Hall of Famer in the bunch. I believe he was elected
by the veterans committee. Most likely his numbers are inflated because
he played most of his career at a bandbox like Ebbets Field.
After age 32 when most players are taking a dive, he's compared to
Mantle, Mays and Frank Robinson. Right.
Big Mac suddenly started staying healthy at age 33. Coincidentally he
and Bonds are the same age.

dan szymborski

In article <1140312402.056024.260000
@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, randyrush21@comcast.net says...

That's a poor argument. Bobby Bonds and Jack Clark had Hall of
Fame-type careers through their 20s. Being compared to them in
their 20s is a compliment, not an insult.

Well, if you actually look at his comparables lists, there are
people named Mays, Reggie, Kiner, Frank Robinson, and Yaz.

Through age 32, Bonds already had 3 MVPs, 6 All-Star games, 6
Gold Gloves, 4 on-base titles, 3 slugging titles, and had
finished out of the top 10 in OBP and SLG only once in his
entire career. He was already approaching 400 home runs and 400
stolen bases. If you think that Greg Luzinski was truly
comparable at this point, seek the nearest methadone clinic.

--
Dan Szymborski
dan@baseballprimerREMOVE.com

"A critic who refuses to attack what is bad is not
a whole-hearted supporter of what is good."

fsogol

Dan Szymborski <dan@baseballprimer.com>Sputtered:


Is this a commercial for Flax Seed?

--
FSogol

rufref

The guy is still juiced and will get caught sooner or later.

randolph

That's who is listed as most similar at age 28. I didn't make the list.
No thanks on the methadone. Hardly know what it is but then again you
seem knowledgable on ths subject. Well read are you?
There is still no denying that the records of all 3 of these guys will
be tainted in the minds of most baseball fans. None of them could have
accomplished what they did without performance enhancing drugs. You
just don't shatter a 37+ year old record with out something like that.
Innocent until proven guilty? Sorry, not in the court of public
opinion. They are no more worthy of the Hall then Pete Rose. I'd put
Joe Jackson in first. At least he had the balls to sign (or X) a
confession and go to court. He was found not guilty incidentally.

dan szymborski

In article <Xns97709D3A2DAC99999999999999999999@70.168.83.30> ,
fsogol@nomorespamplease.nu says...

Since when was Bonds accused of using steroids through age 32?
The evidence for his steroid use was his bulking up *after* age
32 and his connection with BALCO which also happened *after* age
32.

--
Dan Szymborski
dan@baseballprimerREMOVE.com

"A critic who refuses to attack what is bad is not
a whole-hearted supporter of what is good."

dan szymborski

In article <1140482474.067834.217340
@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>, randyrush21@comcast.net says...


There's a whole list you ignored, however, of most similars at
age 28, which includes Duke Snider, Reggie Jackson, Carl
Yastrzemski, and others.

You also don't seem to understand how similarity scores are
derived. They're a toy invented by Bill James, not a serious evaluative tool. I

While it seems likely that Bonds used illegal drugs at this
point, I find it hard to care all that much. Considering the
amphetamine usage of guys like Mays and Snider and Rose (and
actually *dealing* in Mays' case if various grand jury testimony
is true), it's hard to really label any records as "pure" or
"legitimate" over any other.

That's kind of specious reasoning. So, then, Maris *was* on
amphetamines and steroids, the former of which were prevalent in
baseball and the latter easily available by athletes thanks to
dianabol?

Or are 34-year-old records breakable by ordinary means but those
additional 3 years causes said records to become unbreakable?

No. He was not on trial for throwing games, he was on trial for
fraud. During the trial, there was no *question* that the White
Sox threw the games, but nobody believed they did it with the
intention to defraud the public rather than for money.

--
Dan Szymborski
dan@baseballprimerREMOVE.com

"A critic who refuses to attack what is bad is not
a whole-hearted supporter of what is good."